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 FSI Language Courses Forum : Learning Languages : Chinese (Standard)
Message Icon Topic: Pronouncing 俄國 and 法國 Post Reply Post New Topic
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rathpy
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Quote rathpy Replybullet Topic: Pronouncing 俄國 and 法國
    Posted: 28 February 2007 at 4:07pm
FSI (Orientation Module, Unit 3) seems to have unusual tones for "Russia" and "Germany":

- 俄國 e4guo2, whereas every other source seems to say e2guo2
- 法國 fa4guó, whereas every other source seems to say fa3guó

Any accounting for these descrepencies?
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quendidil
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Quote quendidil Replybullet Posted: 30 August 2007 at 7:56am
I have heard fa4guo2 before, but usually while using the term as an adjective 法国餐厅 法国人  it is usually fa3guo2 but I dunno, I'm a native speaker but I don't live in China so I'm not really sure when to use which.

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DemiPuppet
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Quote DemiPuppet Replybullet Posted: 30 August 2007 at 8:58pm
It appears to be a Taiwan/Mainland difference.

My Taiwan dictionary from from the late 1970's lists 4th tone for both when used to transliterate foreign sounds. A Mainland dictionary from about the same time period lists fǎ and é.

The old Mathews dictionary from Shanghai lists fa4 and ngo2.
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xieza
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Quote xieza Replybullet Posted: 31 August 2007 at 12:32am
Originally posted by DemiPuppet

It appears to be a Taiwan/Mainland difference.

My Taiwan dictionary from from the late 1970's lists 4th tone for both when used to transliterate foreign sounds. A Mainland dictionary from about the same time period lists fǎ and é.

The old Mathews dictionary from Shanghai lists fa4 and ngo2.


Sure it is. That's exactly what I would hear on Chinese TV channels. But I don't know why such differences appear.
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Orange
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Quote Orange Replybullet Posted: 13 January 2008 at 8:24am
rathpy,
 
I started my primary schooling in 1980s as a Chinese native ( northern Chinese, to be exact), and speak Mandarin in daily life.  The pronunciation of e2guo2 for 俄国 and that of fa3guo2 for 法国 should be right and contemporarily "standard".  The other options are dated.  I have heard people in old Chinese movies (far back to 1940s and 1930s) pronouce "e4guo2" and "fa4guo2".  So you see, if you have ever found Taiwan people pronounce the forth tone for "fa"and "e", that should have something to do with their father generation's moving from mainland China with Kuomintang to Taiwan in 1940s.  And I noticed you wrote in complicated Chinese characters like "國", that explains somehow also, because today's Taiwan people still use complicated Chinese characters, while we use the simplified ones since 1960s (maybe even earlier).  To be honest, I can read literature in the complicated characters, but can not manage the handwriting except with computer.  My parents' writings are in both here and there, because they learned the complicated ones in school but have to take to the simplified characters in realistic life since the "reformation of Chinese characters", so sometimes could be confused with both ways of writing. 
 
p.s.  I did not realize that "traditional characters" is the proper term for 繁体字 instead of "compllicated characters" until I was kindly reminded a couple of days ago.  For your reference.    


Edited by Orange - 16 January 2008 at 6:05am
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rathpy
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Quote rathpy Replybullet Posted: 15 January 2008 at 11:04pm
Thank you, Orange.
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david808
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Quote david808 Replybullet Posted: 10 November 2008 at 7:27pm
Those are the two cases of pronunciation differences for some characters between Taiwan and Mainland China.

e4
guo2, fa4guó  - Taiwan
e2guo2, fa3guó  -  Mainland China

Arch Chinese
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