Active TopicsActive Topics  Display List of Forum MembersMemberlist  CalendarCalendar  Search The ForumSearch  HelpHelp
  RegisterRegister  LoginLogin
Member Contributions
 FSI Language Courses Forum : Language Courses : Member Contributions
Message Icon Topic: Russian FAST and MSA Arabic Post Reply Post New Topic
Author Message
sarguy
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 24 December 2007
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3
Quote sarguy Replybullet Topic: Russian FAST and MSA Arabic
    Posted: 29 July 2008 at 11:11am
Hey Gang,
 
I have two courses now, one is Modern Standard Arabic and the other is the Russian FAST course. Of the two, I know that the Russian course is from FSI, but the MSA course might be from DLI (not a whole lot of differences, but still).
 
They are already in digital format so if anyone would like them, I'll be glad to submit them!
 
Tom
IP IP Logged
mantis
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 02 May 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 16
Quote mantis Replybullet Posted: 31 August 2008 at 6:53am
YES!!  Please submit the Russian and Arabic.  I am expecially interested i the MSA Arabic.  AhamdAallah!
IP IP Logged
DemiPuppet
Administrator
Administrator


Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 163
Quote DemiPuppet Replybullet Posted: 31 August 2008 at 7:06am
Unfortunately, the MSA material is copyrighted. Or rather there is no evidence that it is not copyrighted. It appears to have been created by a contractor.

But, the Russian FAST course is in the US public domain. I verified all the authors are listed in the State Department employee phone book on the date the book was published. Works created by US government employees as part of their job are not copyrighted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work_of_the_United_States_Government
IP IP Logged
mantis
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 02 May 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 16
Quote mantis Replybullet Posted: 31 August 2008 at 11:47am
All of the FSI/DLI course have always been and will always be in the public domain.  They were created by the US government.  If they were created by a contractor, they are considered Works for Hire and still owned by the US Govt.  Companies like Barron's have been making a small fortune making us believe otherwise.  Even the Plaitquemous course is based on a non-copyrighted work.  The text and recordings of the course are original which makes the work have the same copyright as the original course.
IP IP Logged
DemiPuppet
Administrator
Administrator


Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 163
Quote DemiPuppet Replybullet Posted: 31 August 2008 at 6:14pm
Sorry, works contracted for by the US government are not automatically in the public domain.

The relevant case case is "Schnapper vs Foley" (http://www.altlaw.org/v1/cases/415983).  In that case the US government commissioned the broadcasting station WQED to produce a series of television films about famous early law cases called "Equal Justice Under Law". Schnapper claimed that he (a US citizen) could use the works since they were commissioned and paid for by the US government and thus in the public domain. The Court of Appeals judge ruled against Schapper and asserted that a copyright exists. This case shows up in copyright law books and has been referred to in some Supreme Court cases (i.e. Eldred vs Ashcroft).

The ruling noted that a work may be in the public domain if the government had directly supervised the creation of the work. There is no indication of direct supervision for the DLI courses. This covers works created both before and after the 1978 changes to US copyright law. "Direction" and "Supervision" were the guiding principles.

The rules were clarified after 1978. If the work was created by an independent contractor, the contract must specifically state that the copyright is being transferred to the organization commissioning the work. See "Community for Creative Non-Violence vs Reid" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_for_Creative_Non-Violence_v._Reid).
Also see the definition of "work made for hire" in  section 101  of the US copyright statute 17.

The FSI cases are different since the preface of each course specifically notes that the works were created by an FSI employee as part of their normal duties.  In any event, the text portions of the FSI work are in the public domain since the were published and available to the general public before 1989 without a copyright notice. Until recently DLI was never available to the general public. I don't believe Barron's has ever sold a DLI course. (Some of the DLI Headstart courses are in the public domain since they were sold to the public without a copyright notice).

I'd be happy to hear of any other specific legal cases on the matter.

IP IP Logged
mantis
Newbie
Newbie


Joined: 02 May 2007
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 16
Quote mantis Replybullet Posted: 31 August 2008 at 6:24pm
The courses at DLI were all created under direct Govt. supervision.  I know because I worked in curse development.  In any case, copyrights also have a life span and the courses for DLI were developed so long ago tat the courses should still fall under public domain.  Are the DLI courses vailable for purchase?  Do you know from where?

Regardless of my personal beliefs on the subject, I will respect the rules of the forum in regards to anything I post.

Regards
IP IP Logged
DemiPuppet
Administrator
Administrator


Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 163
Quote DemiPuppet Replybullet Posted: 31 August 2008 at 7:22pm
My understanding of direct supervision means that a supervisor reviewed and directed the work on a daily/weekly basis.  If the contract worker had to periodically submit work for review to hit contract milestones (say monthly), that would not be direct supervision.

As far as I know, the works were never legally published until they showed up earlier this year on the government's ERIC document site. Until then the copyright was held for 120 years after creation.  Now that they are "published", the term is 95 years if created by a corporation, or 70 years after the death of the author if created by an individual(s). The earliest date would be after 2040.

If there is physical evidence of direct supervision by the government (i.e some sort of day to day record of activities, daily or weekly work reports submitted to the government, etc) then they would be government works. Any work created this way would be in the public domain.

Copies of the courses (with audio) periodically show up on EBAY.  The seller usually (falsely) claims that they have some sort of copyright.


Edited by DemiPuppet - 31 August 2008 at 8:51pm
IP IP Logged
Post Reply Post New Topic
Printable version Printable version

Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot create polls in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



This page was generated in 0.094 seconds.